A Discussion with Reading City Council President Donna Reed

Reading City Council President Donna Reed joins Berks County Controller Joe Rudderow to talk about the America 250 PA Berks County events tied to the City of Reading.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:10

Welcome back. I'm County Controller Joe Ruttero here for another episode of County Connections. It's always great to be back in front of the viewers and talk about local government. And today I have uh my guest is uh City Council President, uh Donna Reed. Donna, welcome.

SPEAKER_01 0:28

I'm glad to be here, Jeff. It's good spending time with you again.

SPEAKER_00 0:31

Yes, thank you, Donna. This is exciting. I usually talk uh about the county. I've focused on that uh since since uh taking over uh this episode from Sandy. Uh and uh I thought, boy, you know, there's so much going on. I'd really like to sit down and and you know kind of catch up and and we've got a lot going on in the county. Um we're just about to our nation's birthday. It's exciting.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

Happy birthday, America.

SPEAKER_00 0:59

Yeah, absolutely. And then geez, next year the county celebrates 275. And of course, you know, the city of Reading is is was around before that.

SPEAKER_01 1:09

Yeah, and we celebrated our 275th in 2023.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

In 2023.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

So we're slightly old, technically slightly older than the county, but not really.

SPEAKER_00 1:17

Yeah, well, and and really, I mean, obviously the county uh outdated the founding of the country, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:24

Yeah, so there you go, 1751.

SPEAKER_00 1:26

Right. And uh it's uh it's an exciting time. I know uh we'll get into a couple different things. Um I figured uh in addition to our nation's birthday that we're celebrating, you know, we have uh we're the fan zone for the FIFA World Cup.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:43

Uh that's recently kicked off. So it'll be kind of exciting to see how all that, you know, hopefully positively impacts the city. And I know that the city leaders were very excited to be chosen.

SPEAKER_01 1:57

Yeah, we're one of just a few cities in the state. I think us, Granton, Pittsburgh. Am I missing somebody?

SPEAKER_00 2:03

Um I'm not sure. There was I think you're right, three or four.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

Yeah. So I may I might be missing somebody.

SPEAKER_00 2:12

The the big events are happening in Philly, too. So, you know, maybe that's the one we're not counting.

SPEAKER_01 2:17

Yeah, because it's the major one.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

That's where the that's where you go in person. These others you can go in person, but you're watching it unfold.

SPEAKER_01 2:25

I'm thinking with all with all the folks we have here who came from New York, we probably should have had some party for the last game because of the Knicks winning. I'm sure there were a lot of celebrations here because a lot of a lot of folks I know have come from New York. And I'm sure there's a lot of people rooting for that.

SPEAKER_00 2:39

Uh absolutely. Uh and you know that's a so it's an exciting time. And and uh once again, I'm glad you're able to spend a little bit of time with me today.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Thanks for the invitation.

SPEAKER_00 2:49

You got it. Um why don't we I I usually try to start out getting a a little sense of some history. I mean, we've just done a kind of a real quick round robin on that.

SPEAKER_02 2:58

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 2:59

But um do you want to share with the viewers the a little bit of the history of the founding of the city?

SPEAKER_02 3:04

Sure, sure.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

At least what you what you know. I know you've been very involved for years and are a uh kind of a historian. I think that's your journalism background, maybe.

SPEAKER_01 3:15

Yeah, maybe a history writer, let's put it that way. Um well, obviously the city was originally not a city, it was an area um that was home to our indigenous forebears. Um we just talked about that, the Nabi Del, where we're the folks who were around here. And then I guess around the 1600s or so, the Swedes were actually the first to come in through Amity, the Amity area. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 3:40

When you think of Swedesboro.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Yeah, Swedesboro, there you go. But when you think of the Amity area, and you think of the Mons Jones House, it's the oldest structure in Berks County, what's that, 1618, 1620, something like that. So the Swedes and then the the English, and of course the Penn family with the the deed they got from um Yeah, but I'm forgetting which which monarch it was in England, I can't remember. One of the Georges, I think. But anyhow, they got the deed for the state, which is astonishing when you think about that. But then, of course, uh Richard and Thomas, sons of William Penn, um, were the um the the two that laid out the city of Ratting, this sort of grid pattern. We're sitting right in the heart of it, right here at Forth and Penn. And of course, the streets then had English names. They were they were Prince Street, Duke Street, Queen Street, uh Main Street, Fifth Street was Cal Hill Street after William Penn's wife's maiden name.

SPEAKER_02 4:34

Right.

SPEAKER_01 4:34

Um, so that was sort of the the early start in the 1740s, thereabouts. Um was a borough before it became a city. We celebrate 1748 as our founding time. Um, and we had R275th in 2023. So we uh had lots of activities. Um our coordinator for that was Laura Rapert, a young woman who who she's I think she lives in Oli area now, but she lived in a city for many years, born and raised here. She did a great job. And we had a lot of events. It was very fun.

SPEAKER_00 5:04

And just to think about, just think about that, the 275 years, right? I mean, that's pretty amazing. Um, being um obviously over the years the average lifespans improved for worse. Thank goodness, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:17

In those years it was probably like 45 or something like that.

SPEAKER_00 5:19

Well, and and so you think about it, and and you know, um 75 years, I guess maybe is an average. I don't know if of what people live today. Maybe it's a little more.

SPEAKER_01 5:29

No, I think it's probably a little bit more. I think it's it's a little bit more for women. Sorry about that.

SPEAKER_00 5:34

Well, then you have another 200 years before that. So that's kind of what I'm saying. You know, we we make, you know, obviously the things that we do are important at that moment in time, but so many others have done important things to get us here, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:51

So it was it was interesting because I was watching, I guess, CBS this morning or one one of the shows the other the other day, and they were talking about the time capsule that's being prepared to be open 250 years from now. And it's a national one, it's but it's going to be actually buried in Philadelphia in Independence Hall, and all the prep that goes into it, and you know, stabilizing what's inside of it, what can go inside of it. And there's this tiny little cartridge, it has everything in it from the decoration to the whole so many stories about America, and it's this tiny little thing. So who knows what the technology will be in 2226? No, 2276? 2276, I guess it is. Even that boggles my mind when they said the date. I thought I I doubt we'll be around for that. But maybe the Shirley McLean School of Reincarnation. Maybe some of us will come back.

SPEAKER_00 6:47

Well, it's it's certainly there's a lot of history here, and um, you know, the East has obviously got a lot of that history. We're the oldest part of the country. Yeah, and and sometimes we forget that, right? You go out to a Western state, like, oh, this is so neat and organized. Boy, it really makes a lot of sense. Well, I mean, in the East we were kind of building like, oh, well, that was already done, so we're not gonna mess with that. So now we can add on over here, maybe do something over there. So it it's a totally different different feel.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

And when you think about the Western, you think about like Southern California and Arizona and those places, the indigenous people, what they had done and how how amazingly developed they were, you know, with their villages on this on the mountains. You go out west a lot. Right. And then, you know, when the Spanish first came in Southern California and the missions and stuff, so it's old but it's different the way it was organized. True. Because the the Western Europeans that came here, and the the the English sort of because you look at really old homes, you see Georgian influences and all that kind of stuff from England.

SPEAKER_00 7:58

So remind me now, um the there is a sister city in England.

SPEAKER_01 8:05

Correct, Reading, Reading, England, in Berkshire, but they pronounce it Berkshire. My friend Tony Jones is a former mayor over there. We become pretty good friends. He first was here in 2001, so he knows Reading really well. Coming back in a couple weeks is we have both the delegation from Roiling in Germany, which is our sister city in Germany, southwestern Germany, and Reading, which is our sister city in England. And it's it's really interesting to visit those places. Um Reading, England, I remember going through it in 1984, and it it didn't strike me real well then.

SPEAKER_02 8:39

Right.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

But it has really grown. It's like a technology base, there's a film industry right outside of it. Um is it spelled the same? Spelled the same. It's just interesting. But Berkshire and Berkshire.

SPEAKER_00 8:51

Yes, so the and then but uh today most people are oh, you're from Reading, Pennsylvania. No, I know. No, no, Reading.

SPEAKER_01 8:57

Yeah. Uh but I mean I get it. Then they think it's spelled R E D D like California Reading, but it's um it's an interesting part of uh part of England. Um it's really not far at all from from London. And their train station, which constantly is improved. Um and it's interesting because we talk about transitorien development and ordinances that we're looking at here to try to develop in the event that passenger rail comes back. It should have never left, but in the event it comes back. Over there is passenger rail, which has always been a part of it but continues to grow. They are building around this train station area, which has changed the tenor of that area to a more, I don't know, middle class if that's a word for it, I'm not sure. But they're building a lot of uh mid-level mid-rise flats, market rate. They're leased before they're built because it's so much less expensive to live in Reading, England. Hop on the train, you can get on the train in Reading, England, and you're in Paddington Station in London in 25 minutes. Now imagine that analogy if we could do that with Philly or Metro Philly.

SPEAKER_00 10:03

Well, and then you then you look at like so that infrastructure's been there forever.

SPEAKER_01 10:07

But they're improving upon it.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Correct. And then, you know, uh when you look at how this nation started, and of course you had rail, but the focus wasn't as much, I I mean, I guess initially it was moving people, you know, people would take the train a certain place, but it just seemed to them we drifted away from that, yeah, that whole model. And and so, you know, I've been to Europe uh to Italy, and we took advantage of the high-speed train. Isn't it fabulous? It is. And and we actually um used Rome as our home base.

SPEAKER_01 10:41

Oh, how cool is that.

SPEAKER_00 10:42

And then what we did was we were right across from the Rome Terminal Station. And we could say, you know, you wake up and go, hey, where do you want to go today? And so oh, let's go up to Milan, because by the high-speed train, it's only four and a half hours.

SPEAKER_01 10:55

Stunning.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

And they're like, oh, well, it's raining there. Oh, well, let's just go to Florence and start.

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Right with all the museums at the end.

SPEAKER_00 11:00

And right. And so that's how we did a 10-day trip, my wife and our two youngest sons, and it was really a a fly by the seat of your pants trip that I created. But it was a lot of fun because you weren't pinned down to like, well, we've already pre-registered for this, or or we have to be.

SPEAKER_01 11:17

And isn't it fun when you're you're on the trains and you're interacting with the populace that uses it? I mean, uh to me, that's one of the the fun things of of traveling on the trains is, you know, you're with, of course, your companions you're traveling with, but at the same time, you might be sitting at a seat because there's only one seat there, with a mom and dad and your little kids, and they all start talking to you and you see what the So it's uh I I mean, I love it. I mean, I think it's interesting when you consider that where we're sitting, there was a whole trolley system here in Redding. Yes, and there were the trains that took people back and forth early on the airport that was a fairly strong passenger airport. And when you think of all that and you think of how not just Reading, but other mid-sized cities have evolved, and you go back and we talk about history, you think of of Germany in the terrible 40s or whatever, but how they developed the Autobonds and how President Eisenhower, then a general in the army, saw the movement. If you've driven at all in the Autobonds, I've just briefly been on with friends when we're in our van or whatever. Um he saw that road system in Germany and thought this will work in America. And of course, in the 50s we had the whole, you know, interstate highway system, and that's I think when people suburbia developed all here and everywhere else, and people like those cars.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

And well, without a doubt. And and of course, you know, you and I got to really get to know each other serving on the Reading area transportation stuff. Right. Um and understanding that MPO and how it impacted local transportation and and where the focus is.

SPEAKER_01 13:06

And look at all the money pretty much goes to roads and bridges when you think about it.

SPEAKER_00 13:10

Yeah, and then they prioritize it depending on the district. And you know, uh and not all uh you know, I I'm not sure that all members of the district are have the same priority. Exactly. Why don't I say it too?

SPEAKER_01 13:25

Exactly, because you're you know, you sit here in Ratting, but you're working on something that might be Shoemakersville or Honeybrook or something, and you have to take yourself away from the the sheer municipality you're part of and look at the overview of Burks County. And I think you were off by the time this decision was made by the state, because I think it was only just a short while ago, where the decision was made to put the monies that would have gone into like 222 and Route 16. To the interstates.

SPEAKER_00 13:51

I was just coming off when that when the Do you remember that whole thing? The the the um uh the 422 bypass, I mean, at that time, I think it was $450 million. Now it's probably twice that.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

Oh, easily. And it's gonna be in phases.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

And it needs to be done, or the roundabouts we were very in the early stages of the roundabouts. But you know, just to come back to, you know, the city of Reading is is the fourth largest city in in the Commonwealth.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

I think we're exceeding it. But we all know that the 2020 census had issues between of between COVID and some of the political stuff going on.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

I'm sure.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

So I think we're at 100.

SPEAKER_00 14:31

And and you look at that, and of course, the county and and the other.

SPEAKER_01 14:35

And you guys are what the county total is around 415, 430, something like that.

SPEAKER_00 14:39

That sounds pretty close to it, yeah. And then you look at um the effort, the local effort, but that that uh the city and the county, you know, the commissioners uh have been very uh interested in trying to re-establish rail um back. And and you know, then you know, you uh one of those things where you look at it and say, um when we had it, we didn't appreciate it enough, and then you don't appreciate it until you don't have it, and then you walk back. So some of that stuff, when you get it back, then make sure everyone uses it and it and it becomes a fabric of life.

SPEAKER_01 15:15

You know, I re I remember as a you know as a kid, especially a college student, going down to visit friends in Philly on on the train.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

And I went to school in D.C. and ironically, you couldn't take the train from D.C. to here, you had to go to Philly change at 30th Street over to the Redding Reading Terminal Station, and then come to so I used to always use the bus. We actually had bus connections directly to D.C. in those days. But I remember as a reporter being with uh a bunch of us went over to watch that last train pull out. You know, we're in our 20s and we're looking at it and saying, what are they doing? What are they doing? Right. I'm well beyond my twenties now. It's 1981.

SPEAKER_00 15:56

And I'm just hopeful that Well, I know I know there the there's a lot of passion, at least from local leadership to try to re-establish that. Um and and I believe there's there's a a general um support of the public.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

I think so, too.

SPEAKER_00 16:14

Um and you know, and I'm not sure we're to the point yet where, you know, at some point you hope it there's a big rally um of the residents of Berks County saying this is something that we want in our community. And and I know that's the phase deal. Well, of course. And and um that's that's usually the problem. Everybody wants it, but nobody wants to pay for it.

SPEAKER_01 16:36

And how much the feds will kick in staying, and how much is going to be expected from the county. So that's certainly the you're the controller, so there you go. What can what can you give us?

SPEAKER_00 16:46

Exactly. So um, you know, the the city itself obviously established in 1748, the form of government. Let's talk a little bit about that because um the where where it started and what what it is today. And we don't have to spend a lot of time, but just for structure to understand.

SPEAKER_01 17:06

And I I should probably be better schooled in the early years, but it was it was it started out as a borough, then was incorporated. And it was, you know, m I think maybe five to seven council members and a mayor back then. I'm not sure exactly what kind of form of government you called it in, you know, the 1780s.

SPEAKER_00 17:27

Well, maybe it mirrored the the current borough format.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

In probably something like that. And then when I was a young reporter covering City Hall, and of course the years before that, it was termed the commission form of government. So there were a total of five, one was a mayor, five, five total, four councillors, one was a mayor, and each council member was head of a department. So you were head of fire, or you were head of recreation, or you were head of police or public works, and then a mayor was the overall and also the ministerial person, but everyone had equal votes. The mayor would break ties, of course. And that was a lot of people had big concerns about that. Of course, many of us have read about what happened in the 50s and the 40s and 30s with the rackets and all that kind of stuff. And I'm sure there was some interaction back in those 75 plus years ago, 89 plus years ago. Some things don't change, right? But but anyhow, it it evolved then in um and there were criticisms of it because people with no background were suddenly the head of the police department or the head of the fire department. That's not very cool when you think about it. But anyhow, it it worked and it didn't work. So then in 93, there's before that there was a government study commission. In 93, a referendum was placed to change a form of government from commission to um to this form, which is home rule, strong mayor, um, seven counselors, six district counselors, council president, mayor, auditor. So those are the nine elected officials in the um in the city. And it the referendum passed. I remember at the time thinking it was thinking commissioned form wasn't great, again, having covered it, I saw the weaknesses of it. I thought this was worse. I still think this is worse. I think this is an absolutely terrible form of government. I think it has impeded the progress of the city on many levels. If you look at our system at our neighboring cities, Allentown, Lancaster, Bethlehem, Bethlehem. They're they're doing better than we are. And when you look at this form of government, strong mayor form of government, with all due respect, um the folks who have sat in that position, uh well intended perhaps, but it hasn't worked. And it hasn't worked with with council just being you know, we're the fiduciary stewards, so we have to approve budgets and policy, but we have no administrative ability. So if someone comes to me and you come to me and say, Donna, there's a pothole on my street, I send a note in, copy it to five or six different people out of protocol. Whereas in the old days you could pick up the phone and say, Hey, Joe Schmoe, Jane Doe, and Public Works, there's a pothole. Would you mind going out and getting it?

SPEAKER_00 20:23

Right.

SPEAKER_01 20:23

That wasn't so bad to be able to do that. That's just a small example. Um, the changing faces of, you know, of folks in government. You want you also want you always want fresh blood, but you want some institutional knowledge.

SPEAKER_02 20:37

Well, without doubt.

SPEAKER_01 20:38

You know, I think of I think of Jeff Waldman, who you knew well, our former council president who we lost actually it was four years ago on the 13th that we lost him. And he and I, we were sort of the last survivors of that whole group that did Antietam Lake that fought for it, and we got it. You know, we had talked a couple years ago that we were hoping to finish up and pass on institutional knowledge to new folks coming on, and somehow the things change. You know, you never think you're gonna lose somebody and the good people we've lost, like John Sliffco. You you we were friends with John, you know, Jeff, um, people who have segued off counsel, retired from it, Marsha, uh, Chris Daubert. You know, those are losses that Denny Stirner, those are institutional losses that impact the ongoing work. And with the administration, somewhere Linda Kelleher and I sat down and figured out. We've had, I think, 15 to 20 managing directors since 1996, a number of finance directors. Um, and what that boils down to is the premise of this form of government was you might be mayor one term, I might be mayor the other term, but hopefully the managing director, the finance director, police chief, fire chief, they supersede the political wins. But the charter says mayor appoints these folks. So if I'm the mayor and I and you're my managing director and I come in one day and think, I just don't like red ties. I can say to you, you're done because I don't like your red tie. Not because you're not doing a great job. And I think that has impacted our progress. Again, when you look at Eastern, you look at Allentown, Bethlehem, Langester, that changing guard of of bureaucrats for the government.

SPEAKER_00 22:31

No, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 22:33

Yeah, I'm not I'm not being negative to anybody at this point on council or in the administration, but the arc of the years this hasn't favored us from a progressive standpoint.

SPEAKER_00 22:46

Yeah. Well, um I think there's a tremendous opportunity. I know you believe there's a and and others believe there's a tremendous opportunity in in the city. Oh yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 22:57

Look at Alan Schumann, look at the great stuff he's done.

SPEAKER_00 22:59

Well, and to figure out what is the attraction and how do you leverage that. And you know, I think that's where some of the other cities, Allentown and Bethlehem and even Easton, have kind of figured something out. And each is a little bit different. I don't think they've all figured out the same thing. Um, but you know, you want people to wake up in a neighboring county and say, well, today I want to go into Reading because I want to enjoy, I'll just make this up. You know, I want to enjoy the local cuisine uh and that just happens to be, you know, we have a very um heavy Latino population. What a great opportunity if if that were, you know, what you wanted to do and you wanted to come in and try different food that maybe you're not usually accustomed to eat or enjoy music or or whatever that is. And and so I look, you know, I'm optimistic. I think it will work itself out. Um, of course, you know, sooner rather than later is always better, right?

SPEAKER_01 24:01

Well, and you think of, and we talked about this before before we started on air, but you know, every city and every area is a story of migration, from you know, the the early, you know, our indigenous folks, and then the Swedes and the English and the Germans and the other Western Europeans and the Eastern Europeans, and then in the early tw early 20th century, our first Latino folks coming over from Puerto Rico, which is a part of this country, and then emigration certainly from tw to the the year 2000 till now has changed the the demographics of the city. It is now 70 percent Latino. Right. There's a lot of new breath and energy that comes with that, which is great, re reviving neighborhoods, things like that. I think one of our biggest challenges, and I and I don't mean this to be negative, but many times, you know, we talk about the Lehigh Valley. Well that encompasses everybody. The hills, the the countryside, Allentown, Bethel, Easton. Here, it's Reading and Berks County.

SPEAKER_02 25:00

Right.

SPEAKER_01 25:00

We haven't pulled it together under the Schuylkill Valley. And when you look at the demographics, while the inner ring suburbs are starting to change and reflect more of what Reading looks like, there still seems to be a hesitancy among some folks in the county to think they're gonna come in here and they're gonna get mugged, or they're gonna come in here and they're gonna it's it's dangerous. It's not. I I've chosen to make my life here. I grew up on a farm in Muhlenburg. I've been the city at night during the day.

SPEAKER_00 25:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:29

It's okay.

SPEAKER_00 25:30

Well, and and you know, you're um six-term uh council member.

SPEAKER_01 25:38

And and and you'd be mostly mostly District 5, mostly northwestern Reading.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

Yeah, so we're we are really uh just about out of time. I it's uh always hard to believe. Um, and geez, we could talk another two hours because we didn't even really scratch on some of what I was gonna do. But um why don't we mention, I mean, obviously we talked a little bit about the 250. I'm wearing my red white. Very good.

SPEAKER_01 26:02

And I should have worn my I have my little flag.

SPEAKER_00 26:04

You have your little flag on, we have our flags. We also um I want to mention that the the FIFA fan zone. Yes, absolutely. I know the city was very um very excited to very excited about that. And that's July 3rd, 4th, 18th, and 19th, I believe, are the dates of the fan zone and the 700 block being Absolutely, and and probably um the back half of those games, hopefully anyone that's taking the time to watch our um show today will will get out and and support it.

SPEAKER_01 26:37

And if and if they're around, if they um they see some folks that look that they don't know, we have a delegation of five folks coming from Roilingen, Germany, to help us celebrate Mayor Mayor Kack and three of the counselors and one of the um folks who does the coordination of the Sister Cities program, and Tony Jones, a former mayor of Reading England, will be here through the 4th of July for your event, for the county event, the Star Spangled. Spectacular out at the fairgrounds, which should be really terrific.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

I'm excited about that. So there's a lot going on. Um, Donna, I want to thank you again for the what little I mean you gave me uh time, but you know, we just I l I love chatting with you and the and there's so much to say. Uh I think that we're both excited to celebrate our nation's birthday. Absolutely I know we're both excited to celebrate our county's birthday next year.

SPEAKER_01 27:24

Absolutely. There's so much going on. The city will be we're working with um all the commissioners on that. So especially um New Year's Eve this year. So watch that. The city is gonna be very much working with that. We'll work with Commissioner uh Santoni, who's who's reading that off. So lots of fun stuff going on. And I'm just gonna put a plug in. We're working on a pagoda. It's gonna take a little while till the interior is totally open, but when people see the changes up there, yeah, they're gonna be happily astonished at what the pagoda is going to be like on the interior.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

That is excellent. So, well, folks, I want to thank you again for tuning in to County Connections. I'm Joe Ruttero, your county controller. And until next time, thank you.